We need Ravipedia!?

[LaLia]

Just a quick explanation for anyone who missed it in the chat: I’m currently planning Season 2 of my story "Das Internat" and realizing just how extensive the world-building has become. I started thinking about how I could provide readers with a quick overview—covering the various characters, the plot so far, and so on.

That’s how I came up with the idea for a thread structured like a Wikipedia entry: a list of characters with brief descriptions, locations, summaries of the seasons, and links to the individual seasons or spin-off stories.

Naturally, the question arose: where should this go, and is it even allowed? The Book Club? A story collection? I wasn't sure, which is why I asked in the chat. Sure, a new post in my own story collection was an option, but the layout wouldn't be ideal—it would clutter up both the collection and the wiki-style thread. I’d prefer a dedicated thread that clearly indicates what can be found inside.

Do I expect this to make more people read the story? No; the idea is simply to give the reader a better overview. This is especially helpful for stories written over a long period or those with extensive world-building. Ideally, someone joining three months from now could read a long-running story without having to catch up on 100 previous installments. At the same time, long-time readers could check the thread whenever they have a question—much like how we Google things in real life when watching a TV series and wonder, "Wait, what did that character do again?"

I’d be interested to hear your thoughts on this. It would probably only be relevant for certain stories, but I think having the option would be great. In my opinion, a dedicated sub-forum would be best—either within the Book Club or alongside the stories themselves.

So, who else is Team Ravipedia?

[AdmiralPiet]

My initial thought would be to put it into your story collection. But you are right on the cluttering part.

I guess a separate thread could work, but then not every author should do their own thing.
Maybe if we follow a template like you suggested.

But how to keep that from cluttering by replies?
I guess we wouldn't have that many threads like that, so maybe they could be locked afterward and for editing you would need to call upon a mod?

In general I am with you, but a lot of details need to be hammered out first.

[RapeU]

This is an idea that would probably end up only reaching a small group of readers, but I still think it's worth it for the readers that do decide to get the extra lore. Star Wars has Wookiepedia. Likely the vast majority of people don't know it exists, but it's still helpful to go to for people like me who watch things beyond just the movies.

No idea how to implement this though. Perhaps someone with technical experience? @LtBroccoli @Vela Nanashi

[LtBroccoli]

I love this idea. I want to steal it for the Harbor City Universe.

If we're doing this within the normal threads we have, maybe something in the Book Club or the Author's Pages could be where the stub rests. But there's enough larger stories and universes that we might want to have a separate Ravipedia thread.

Thinking we treat it like a Wikipedia page for a movie or TV show. The stub post has the basics, and if we want to add more to them, they would be like reply posts. Since it's a forum, the branches could be like chapters in a story. As long as we remember to link back to the stub, should be a good starting point.

[AdmiralPiet]

I gave this some thought over the evening.

Would this be a possible solution?
We create a sub-forum in either "Book Club" or "Authors' Story Collections" called: Companion Threads
To preserve cluttering only a limited number of people can post. Group "Companion Thread posters" would be needed (I hope that is possible from a technical standpoint: All can read, few can post)

Rules:
Companion threads are only possible for multiple interconnected stories. (At least 2, maybe more?) Example: @Claire's Record Chaser Universe, or @RapeU's Hannah and Wendy.
The stories need to have a combined word count of at least 15.000 words (or more?)
Only the story author posts in his companion thread, no comments allowed.
For the first companion thread one has to apply for it with a mod or admin to be added to the Companion Thread Posters Group.

A companion threads structure is up to the author, but a structure must be there.
For example:
Post 1: Index and character factsheets/biographies
Post 2: Locations
Post 3: Tech/Magic

Only one thread per universe.
A second Companion Thread is allowed if it is indeed a separate universe.
For the second thread one does not have to apply because they are already in the group, but it is of course subject to the rules and moderation.

@RapeU @Claire @LaLia @LtBroccoli @Vela Nanashi @Lucius

[Claire]

I think your best option would be to test this extension here that adds a knowledgebase to the forum:

https://github.com/Crizz0/knowledgebase

I think that might even be closer to what @LaLia has in mind than a wiki because in a wiki other users could edit her lore/character glossary page for her story. In a knowledgebase she could have full authorial control over the custom page she creates.

There is also a wiki extension for phpbb, but that one wasn't updated for 10 years or so. No idea whether that would still be compatible with modern phpbb versions.

[LtBroccoli]

I gave this some thought over the evening.

Would this be a possible solution?
We create a sub-forum in either "Book Club" or "Authors' Story Collections" called: Companion Threads
To preserve cluttering only a limited number of people can post. Group "Companion Thread posters" would be needed (I hope that is possible from a technical standpoint: All can read, few can post)

Rules:
Companion threads are only possible for multiple interconnected stories. (At least 2, maybe more?) Example: @Claire's Record Chaser Universe, or @RapeU's Hannah and Wendy.
The stories need to have a combined word count of at least 15.000 words (or more?)
Only the story author posts in his companion thread, no comments allowed.
For the first companion thread one has to apply for it with a mod or admin to be added to the Companion Thread Posters Group.

A companion threads structure is up to the author, but a structure must be there.
For example:
Post 1: Index and character factsheets/biographies
Post 2: Locations
Post 3: Tech/Magic

Only one thread per universe.
A second Companion Thread is allowed if it is indeed a separate universe.
For the second thread one does not have to apply because they are already in the group, but it is of course subject to the rules and moderation.

@RapeU @Claire @LaLia @LtBroccoli @Vela Nanashi @Lucius

I like pretty much all of this. I would like to allow comments because sometimes either I forgot what I was trying to do or someone reading it caught something different. Maybe we include mentions for crossovers down the line, or throw little easter eggs in for characters and locations.

[LaLia]

I'm glad you like the idea.

I’d suggest starting with the simplest option, which would likely be a sub-forum. As I said, people will find it via links anyway. I think people are more likely to check out Ravipedia because of the story than the other way around.

I wouldn't go overboard with the rules, either.
Mandating a structure for the stories is a good thing given the legal considerations, but we should allow users some freedom and creativity. I don't think we need to mandate a specific template for this. Why? I'll get to that in a moment.

The same applies to having too many rules about "when" and "who." The idea that you can only do this once you have two combined stories is nonsense. A single story—perhaps in the fantasy or sci-fi genre—with extensive world-building could make great use of this. Take TV examples like *Game of Thrones* or *Lord of the Rings*: both are series or stories where the lore alone is almost as vast as the story itself.

Regarding those two points—mandating a structure and restricting it to the second story onwards—we have to ask: who is actually going to use this? It’ll be us—the current or former admins and mods, or those who have already written hundreds of posts on the board. Don't forget that creating a companion story like this requires a huge investment of time and writing effort; for that reason alone, not many people will actually do it. I trust everyone who has replied here to use their own creativity to build this without getting bogged down in a complicated set of rules. A guide or a "how-to" would definitely suffice.

However, I completely agree with the question of whether others should be able to comment in the thread. The issue there is technical feasibility: can we restrict it so that only the thread creator can edit it and post replies? If necessary, I could live with allowing replies, provided it doesn't get out of hand or detract from the feedback the stories themselves receive. But a hint would certainly help there.

[AdmiralPiet]

I think your best option would be to test this extension here that adds a knowledgebase to the forum:

I have zero knowledge with forum extensions. Would that be easy to implement and test?

I like pretty much all of this. I would like to allow comments because sometimes either I forgot what I was trying to do or someone reading it caught something different. Maybe we include mentions for crossovers down the line, or throw little easter eggs in for characters and locations.

When I said no comments, I meant no comments by other users.
It is just the posts the author made, no other users cluttering up the space in between.

[/quote]

I wouldn't go overboard with the rules, either.
Mandating a structure for the stories is a good thing given the legal considerations, but we should allow users some freedom and creativity. I don't think we need to mandate a specific template for this.

Yes. Just a structure, not a specific one. Just to prevent companion threads that can't fulfil their function because they are a disjointed mess.
There is some leeway too.

One user might use a very orderly structure, with numbers and alphabetical order

1
1.1
Text
1.2
Text

Others:

People

Places

As long as there is some structuring to allow the thread to function as a quick reference handbook, it would be alright.

The same applies to having too many rules about "when" and "who." The idea that you can only do this once you have two combined stories is nonsense. A single story—perhaps in the fantasy or sci-fi genre—with extensive world-building could make great use of this. Take TV examples like *Game of Thrones* or *Lord of the Rings*: both are series or stories where the lore alone is almost as vast as the story itself.

Yes, that is correct. One big story may be more complex than five smaller ones. But I would still keep the wordcount of at least a "long" story, either in one single story or combined.

Regarding those two points—mandating a structure and restricting it to the second story onwards—we have to ask: who is actually going to use this? It’ll be us—the current or former admins and mods, or those who have already written hundreds of posts on the board. Don't forget that creating a companion story like this requires a huge investment of time and writing effort; for that reason alone, not many people will actually do it. I trust everyone who has replied here to use their own creativity to build this without getting bogged down in a complicated set of rules. A guide or a "how-to" would definitely suffice.

I had that in mind. Those people would of course instantly get the role of "Companion Thread Poster".
But if we have no limitations we might see a number of companion threads for medium or even short stories that don't need it at all. But on what basis would a moderator delete that if there is no rule?

However, I completely agree with the question of whether others should be able to comment in the thread. The issue there is technical feasibility: can we restrict it so that only the thread creator can edit it and post replies? If necessary, I could live with allowing replies, provided it doesn't get out of hand or detract from the feedback the stories themselves receive. But a hint would certainly help there.

I think if replies are not allowed and the number of people who can post in the subforum are limited to the ones who actually put the work in, and have already some words under their belt (hence the 15.000 word threshold) those people can be trusted to honour that rule, and in the odd case one does not it is easy for moderators to correct.

4 Rules:
1. You have to apply to be added to the group to open a companion thread
2. The story or stories your thread is a companion to needs to have at least 15.000 words in total
3. Your thread needs to have a discernible structure (how exactly you do it is up to you)
4. Only the author posts in a companion thread, all other posts are deleted

I think that is not overly complicated or bogged down (?)
If we go with @Claire's knowledgebase suggestion I guess No. 4 would no longer apply.

[Claire]

I have zero knowledge with forum extensions. Would that be easy to implement and test?

Yes.


Regarding the subforum solution you can do the following things:

1) Allow users to create new topics but not to reply. You would limit the author to a single post, though.

2) You create a new user group that authors who want to create a topic for their stories need to apply to and be added to manually (like the Pillars for example). Users in that user group can create topics AND reply to topics. Users not in that user group can only read. The only users that can now cause problems by creating replies are other authors who also are members of that user group. So technically, you'd still might have to do some moderation work occasionally. But you rule out that some random user who just registered posts some stuff without knowing the rules.

What the forum permission settings don't allow is to say: Users can create topics AND reply to ONLY their own topics. That permission doesn't exist.